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Don Monfils

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I had a job to do with LVP on stair treads.
The customer wanted metal stair nose metal.
I needed to cut 15 pieces of metal so I bought this aluminum/ non- ferrous metal blade.
It worked great on the 90° cuts.
The cuts were cleaner than the factory ends.
I had one 45° miter. I placed the metal hanging over a piece of 2x4 and started to cut it and it ripped the piece out of my hand giving ma a little cut on one finger and bruising another.
I tried one more time cutting very slowly.
It did the same thing.
I ended up cutting a notch out of the top edge and folding it around the corner.

Do you have any suggestions for cutting miters in the metal?
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I like how you snipped and folded the corner. I think that way is almost a better way because the corner is rounded. A mitered corner will be sharp. I’ve had a couple jobs where I installed bamboo baseboards. You wanna talk about a sharp ass miter, that sum bitch will cut you its so damn crisp. Imagine stubbing your toe on a corner😳 I would take the shaft of a screwdriver and run it up and down the miter to blunt it.

That blade is prolly the 10” equivalent to my 12” so it will definitely work for your needs. Now let’s get to making it work. Prolly the simplest thing would be to flip the metal upside down so it’s up against the fence and the bed. Then I would put a piece of wood on top of that. If you’re worried about it kicking, clamp that shit down and keep your hands clear. Depending on your saw, you may want to have a piece of wood up against the fence then the metal then another piece of wood to sandwich all that mess together. Clamp and pray, don’t forget your safety glasses.

As far as why the metal is kicking, my unscientific answer, or maybe it IS scientific, is it has to do with the angle that the blade is striking, making contact with, the metal at. There’s plenty of teeth so that’s not it. Imagine how the metal will react if you were to just chop cut it vs if you were to pull the head all the way out then lower the head and slide the blade back into the workpiece. That’s what I’m talkin about.

I don’t have a 10” saw but my Dewalt 7.25” slider is a kickin mofo. Cutting metal or plastic transitions on that saw scares me because it’s almost guaranteed it will kick. Then there is the fact that the fence on that saw isn’t all that much either. That’s a plywood blade but you get the idea, if there’s nothing there for support, something is gonna go flying. I’ve also had pieces hook and catch and get jammed in the saw. It makes a loud noise and the whole shop knows exactly what you did. Blades with more teeth do make a difference but I just don’t trust that saw for those cuts.

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The second picture you can see a 2x3 and a piece of 1.5” angle aluminum on the bench behind the saw. How the metal and wood are on the bench is how I clamp them to my saw. If I’m worried about tear out behind the workpiece, I may put another piece of wood behind all that mess to keep things in place then clamp it all up before I make my cut.

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I don’t have crazy kicking issues when I use my 12” slider. Bigger saw, bigger blade, different angle of attack? I don’t know but it doesn’t kick like my other saw does.

Sandwich and clamp your workpiece and you’ll be fine. If you expect and plan for the kick, you’ll eliminate the kick.

Almost forgot the best part, hopefully you’re plunging the blade into the cut in a steady and controlled manner. I had a guy that was doing some bamboo stair nose for me years ago and he couldn’t get a clean cut to save his life. Every cut was tearing out like a mofo. I didn’t know what he had for a blade so I went and bought a quality wood blade from a real shop so he could complete the job. He had a Bosch 10” miter saw and I remember the blade I got was maybe $120 10 years ago. I guarantee that blade will do the trick, right. So I get to the job site and give duder the blade. He changes it out and I’ll be damned if it isn’t doing the same thing on his next cut, just splintering real bad. So now I’m watchin him to see why it’s splintering and wondering what the heck. He would click the saw on and just mash the blade through the stair nose like a friggin tweaker or something. I saw that and I lost my shit on dude because I just blew a couple hours of my time and bought an unnecessary saw blade all because he couldn’t slow down and let the saw do the work.
 
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Thanks Chris, that’s some good info.
I think putting the piece in backwards is a great idea. I was cutting it like it was sitting on the step.Also pulling the blade forward and sliding it into the metal would be better.
I was chopping it straight down ( no slide action) but cutting pretty it slowly.
Yeah, I think the way I did the corner was was better in the long run.

Randy your right, the metal was a lighter gauge (from home depot) It was $18.99/ 12’ length

The metal from the flooring store was $44 (each my cost) X 5 pieces

I’m hope this new blade works good on lvp transitions also. I have some stairnose with miters and a return to cut for my house.
🤞🏼

Thanks for the advice!
 
Gotta admit I’m not a fan of sliding the blade out, lowering it then sliding it back while making your cut on aluminum. I just chop cut it unless it’s wide enough that I need to slide the blade.

Think about this, when the blade is all the way lowered and brought back into the cut the angle of attack will have a different direction than if you were to just chop cut the piece. If that angle isn’t down and back, towards the bed and the fence, which will resist kicking, you are opening up the opportunity for a kick to happen. If the blade is lowered and the angle of attack has some upward direction to it, even though you’re bringing the saw head down, that metal can hook and go flying if you don’t have it securely clamped.

Let’s say you’re just going to chop cut a piece of aluminum. Think about the angle the blade is striking the material at if the material is resting up against the fence. Now put a 2” block of wood up against the fence then your piece of metal against the wood. With the addition of the wood, when you make the chop cut the angle of attack is different than when the metal is up against the fence because you’ve moved the material in relation to where the blade will be making contact thereby changing the angle of attack. The concept is the same as if you were to crank the blade all the way up on your table saw (who does that??) because that will give you the cleanest cut on a laminate plank. Why, because the tooth of the blade is coming straight down on the laminate. When you crank the blade all the way up you’re changing the angle of attack.
 
I used that blade on some black versatrim 1/4 round. Super clean cuts, and my returns did not go flying.
 
Hey Chris, I see a tool sales / technical representative job in your future. Dam you’re good.

Rabbit holes, it’s all about rabbit holes and I’ve gone down a few. Here’s a good bit of information regarding saw blades, their teeth and the associated engineering of those teeth. It will help you to understand the whys of how a saw blade works, or in the case of kickback, why it doesn’t.

With saw blades you can pick n choose what geometry you want as far as the angles of everything. By moving the material around to different positions and angles on the miter saw, you are changing the angles without changing the blade.

https://carbideprocessors.com/pages/saw-blades/saw-tip-angles.html
 
Thanks Chris, that’s some good info.
I think putting the piece in backwards is a great idea. I was cutting it like it was sitting on the step.Also pulling the blade forward and sliding it into the metal would be better.
I was chopping it straight down ( no slide action) but cutting pretty it slowly.
Yeah, I think the way I did the corner was was better in the long run.

Randy your right, the metal was a lighter gauge (from home depot) It was $18.99/ 12’ length

The metal from the flooring store was $44 (each my cost) X 5 pieces

I’m hope this new blade works good on lvp transitions also. I have some stairnose with miters and a return to cut for my house.
🤞🏼

Thanks for the advice!
Don here's the reason I mentionef the thickness.
Though this isn't a fair comparison, think of cutting a one and a half inch wide piece of galvanized corner flashing with a metal blade and now think of cutting 1/8 in thick piece of angle steel.
I think in a chop saw, the two different gauges of stair nose metals might behave quite different. The thinner, less expensive one might even be a softer composition of aluminum, making what happened in your situation much more probable
I'm shootin' from the hip cuz that's all I got. 😁
Unless you have a buttload of stairs to do, I've had good luck cutting those by hand with a hacksaw. You might even be able to make a neat little template out of some heavy cardboard or poster board to scratch the 45 into the metal. You'd probably need a couple strokes with a file afterward but it's quite doable.
 
Did you read the snippet on saw blade teeth and all that kinda good stuff? Hopefully so, it may just save your bacon one day.

In that snippet it mentions that you want a negative hook angle for cutting metal. The 10” blade that you have, Don, and the 12” blade that I have both have a 5 degree hook angle. That’s prolly why you experienced a little kick when you were cutting aluminum.

Your saw blade is a Diablo D1084L. If you can get a Diablo D1080N, it’s a similar saw blade but it has 4 less teeth and a 5 degree negative hook. 4 less teeth ain’t nothing but that simple 10 degree difference in the hook angle ( from 5 degrees of hook angle to 5 degrees of negative hook angle) makes a big difference in how it cuts, big enough that you may not like how that blade performs for you when you’re not cutting aluminum.

The 10x50 combination blade you don’t like has a 15 degree hook angle to it. It sent your piece of 1/4 round flying, can you imagine trying to cut a piece of aluminum with it. I can already hear the piece of aluminum getting sucked up and jammed in the saw because it wasn’t clamped down.

So maybe you don’t buy a specific blade with a negative blade hook angle for cutting aluminum, I haven’t and I cut aluminum pretty regularly, but just knowing all this information will help you to make successful cuts with the blades you have while keeping your fingers in tact.
 

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