Stair Staple placement

[MSLI]

I pulled a flight of waterfall stapled stairs, installed by my partner/subcontractor today. He’s a seasoned professional 6’5 260.00 ish, a good man, BUT ! His staple placement on start and stop steps, imho sucks donkey “D” ….. Toooo close to the crotch on both start and stop, AND HE must put all 260 lbs behind it. I was crying the hole time.

I usually staple a good 1” away, that way the staples usually come out with the carpet and don’t leave a rats nest behind.
I had to use a hammer against my staple puller to get under the staples.

 

[DarisMulkin]

No tackless on the bottom step, why?

 

[MSLI]

No tackless on any of the 13 steps. I decided after installing a handful of stairs using tackless, that it wasn’t worth the extra time to do so.

 

[JPfloor]

No tackless on any of the 13 steps. I decided after installing a handful of stairs using tackless, that it wasn’t worth the extra time to do so.

Well if you're worried about the ease of the rip up it's well worth it... Makes the next install easier too.

We used to pull up a flight of warn waterfalled steps, clean the carpet, turn it around or shift it down a half a step, and reinstall it. That leaves the warn part on the riser... Pretty sure nobody does that anymore...

 

[DarisMulkin]

Well if you're worried about the ease of the rip up it's well worth it... Makes the next install easier too.

We used to pull up a flight of warn waterfalled steps, clean the carpet, turn it around or shift it down a half a step, and reinstall it. That leaves the warn part on the riser... Pretty sure nobody does that anymore...

I think I only did a couple of stair shifts. But that was back in the day when carpet was carpet, not junk. I bet todays installers wouldn't have a clue how to do it or even have heard of it.

 

[JPfloor]

I think I only did a couple of stair shifts. But that was back in the day when carpet was carpet, not junk. I bet todays installers wouldn't have a clue how to do it or even have heard of it.

Yes, we did it primarily with woven wools that didn’t wear very well on steps. This process doubled the life…Wouldn’t work too well with a dried out brittle piece of tufted goods. These days everyone just wants new.

 

[MSLI]

Pretty sure nobody does that anymore...

I just recently installed this one, but previously, appx. 5 years ago, I shifted their old runner.

I agree JP, tackless for the win, and that’s why I did a hand full of them. Just Recently replaced one and it was pleasantly easier. I may need to revisit my decision and do it quickly, because my hours on my knees are numbered.

All I’m saying is if your installing a staple friendly carpet that doesn’t show the marks, STOP stapling the Start and stop pieces so darn close to the edge of the goods and for God’s sake STOP applying so much pressure to the gun. Rant possibly over

 

[highup]

With the exception of stapling under the bullnose, I've never stapled an entire set of stairs so I wouldn't know what the preferred method would be. I was asked to restretch / tighten up a set of stairs once. Well, that wasn't going to happen because it was stapled
I agree, you don't want to put your body weight onto the stapler. It almost cuts all the way through the carpet.
If because of a carpet type that may require staples, do you put a row an inch up on the riser and another row an inch out from the riser onto the tread?

 

[MSLI]

I agree, you don't want to put your body weight onto the stapler. It almost cuts all the way through the carpet.
If because of a carpet type that may require staples, do you put a row an inch up on the riser and another row an inch out from the riser onto the tread?

Thanks for that validation !

Yes ! 1” or more on riser and 1/2” to 1” on tread…… I install a bit unconventional due to conditions and my brain condition Many of the stairs have a gap between riser and tread. So the typical crotch stapling method is not always adequate. After stretching with Crain staircase tool, I use the nose of the gun to remove the slack, then staple into the riser 1 to 2” above the crotch. ( for a 3’ step, appx. 8 staples) Then make a nice 90 degree tuck into the crotch and shoot appx. 10 staples into the tread, 1” away…. Full flight, already padded would take appx 1.50 hours and removal is now easier because most of the staples pull out with the carpet.

 

[highup]

With thin carpet have you tried shorter staples? 9/16" are pretty much the only staple readily available.
If you look, you can find 5/16. Once in a while you really need the shorter ones. I wish tackers could shoot 3/8, 7/16, 9/16 and on occasion, 5/8 would eliminate the need for hand tacking.

 

[Darren Ramey]

Out here 95%+ sets of stairs are upholstered under the nose. So you get that in two spots. I always stick the staples in the crotch as tight as I can then I beat them in with a hammer and stair tool to hide them. I use a metric shit ton of staples. The more you use, the less they show IMHO. Everyone around here dreads having to pull up a set I put on, myself included.

 

[DarisMulkin]

I found the easiest way to pull up contoured stepw was to stat at the top and pull first riser and crotch. then all ai had to do was step on the carpet to pull the nose off and repeat. that would pull most of the staples out from under the nose.

 

[JPfloor]

Out here 95%+ sets of stairs are upholstered under the nose.

That’s true everywhere I think. Although still used in some traditional designs waterfall is a style of days gone by…

The installation you describe is what I would refer to as a “permanent installation”. Some ultra thin carpets the drop from the pad to the tackless as well as the pins might show through so I would use that method otherwise I’d use tackless… Easier and quicker if you have a helper installing it… Way easier if it’s an account where you will be changing the carpet on a regular basis.

 

[MSLI]

The more you use, the less they show IMHO.

Yes I agree for none-staple friendly carpets that’s the go to method. Like Highup said, shorter staples would be a good idea, like we did on this one.

 

[MSLI]

Removed another disgusting 2 Br. Apartment early ( I bill extra for that ) due to cat hair, and pee. I actually vacuumed 5” of the perimeter before removing to keep the hair and dust down.

Notice on the stair removal, no rat nest left behind between runs, due to the different staple placement .75” away from crotch. Also notice the unique way of pad installation, to make it easier to remove.

 

[C.J.]

Definitely interesting. You’re in a situation where replacements happen a lot more frequently than in a typical residential setting. And since you’re the one replacing your own work, why wouldn’t you try to find a way that minimizes that removal labor yet still has what it takes to stand up to a renters abuse.

I don’t believe anybody hardly ever thinks about the demo of whatever job they’re installing except for what a poor SOB the next installer will be because they have to demo your bomb proof installation. Good food for thought.

 

[MSLI]

I don’t believe anybody hardly ever thinks about the demo of whatever job they’re installing except for what a poor SOB the next installer will be because they have to demo your bomb proof installation. Good food for thought.

There’s a reason behind all this and that’s because I was and still am the next installer demoing my work and others,
‘ bomb proof’ installs ( great term ! Funny as hell ) and to make it even more meaningful, ( frustrating) the last installers were my father’s employees, that I asked to train, but was turned down, due to the added cost ( hey Pop in the grave imho short term gains, eventually become long term losses ) …..where was that wisdom when I needed it ? It was blocked out by ego youthful testosterone.

….. And that’s why David Hunt ( one of the most well respected Carpet Installers/ instructors of our time) Said ! “ It’s not about my work being better than your work, it’s about my work today, being better than my work yesterday “

Lead yourself to better tomorrows, then teach and share with others, but in the end, acknowledge inherent free will, as they may actually come up with a way that suits them better differently.

Thanks C. J. I appreciate you acknowledging my pursuit to work smarter not harder

 

[highup]

Is there a "Davids book of quotes" available on Amazon? It might be short, but it would be good.

 

[highup]

Definitely interesting. You’re in a situation where replacements happen a lot more frequently than in a typical residential setting. And since you’re the one replacing your own work, why wouldn’t you try to find a way that minimizes that removal labor yet still has what it takes to stand up to a renters abuse.

I don’t believe anybody hardly ever thinks about the demo of whatever job they’re installing except for what a poor SOB the next installer will be because they have to demo your bomb proof installation. Good food for thought.

I use security screws now instead of staples because I'm never tearing out another one of my own sets of stairs.

 

[MSLI]

Just found a unit where I installed tackless.

Hey Highup / C. J. I think the hard surface installer could have used your expertise, what would you have done / appx. Cost …..Looks like newly renovated apartments are going with LVP in Lr,Dr, hall and The installer wants me to cover the exposed nose